[Ldraw-content] Forwarding thoughts about the MOTM/SOTM contest

[James Reynolds]

Tim, your reply helped me focus what I'm trying to say.  I think the  
ultimate goal is to generate interest in creating more LDraw files,  
and preferably files of high quality MOC's.

I'll reply to a few of your comments and then give a list of rules  
and changes I would like to see.

>> Here is another way of putting it.  There are ton's of SUPER MOC's
>> out there made by AFOL who have built up a reputation of quality
>> building, but they don't use LDraw.  If those people made LDraw
>> models of their MOC's, they could easily win every contest hands
>> down.  And there are tons of SUPER POV-Ray users out there who don't
>> use LDraw.  If they did and imported the objects into POV-Ray, they
>> could build background scenes that again, nobody could challenge.
>
> But there isn't and probably never will be a reason for them to start.

Prizes?

> There is no way that LDraw competitions will ever be as prestigious as
> real brick ones because too many people have an animosity towards it.
> The amount of criticism I used to get on CSF (and still do to a lesser
> extent) is extraordinary. Look at point 1) here
> (http://fbtbforums.net/viewtopic.php? 
> p=223624&sid=b5909870de9ea024caf8e5c2f3d8ef08#223624)
> and see the comments of a long term and quite respected AFOL (Dave
> Eaton). The only theme which seems relatively accepting of CAD seems
> to be trains.

Well, actually, I build physically too.  I thought everyone did (I  
know Burkhard "Primus" (brickcommander.com) doesn't though).  Dave  
Eaton's points are exactly why I would want a panel of judges to go  
over an entry.

I think animosity is directly proportional to quality.  The higher  
the quality of the entries and winners, the higher the prestige and  
acceptance by non-LDraw users.

>> And to complicate matters more, Mladen, IMO, could win every month if
>> he submitted his models.  Again, this goes to show the disconnect.
>> Why isn't he submitting his models?  He is both a genius MOC builder
>> AND an LDraw user!
>
> Mladen hasn't built anything for a very long time and isn't likely to
> in the near future due to his studies. He's not a renderer either so
> although his stuff is amazing and very well modelled he's not likely
> to be entering the SOTM any time soon.

Well, he's posted 4 MOC's and one LDraw file from this year:

http://www3.sympatico.ca/mladenpejic/MMP.htm

Certainly a contest winner.

>> And personally, I know the idea behind the simple unappealing model
>> renders is to make them fair, but they are not fun to look at.  I
>> think they need to be ray traced with complimentary scenes and
>> lighting.  And it wouldn't hurt to have 360 degree spins of the
>> models, and maybe even take apart spins too.  Again, I think this
>> will increase the prestige.
>
> I agree with this point but it ends up being a lot of work for the
> people running it. I recently had to coordinate a set of standard
> render settings for a large group of people and farming out is not so
> easy and ends up taking a fair amount of time for each model.

I have about 400 computers I use to render my POV-Ray animations.  My  
last animation had 6000 frames (averaged into 200).  I render Anton's  
animations.  I've offered my grid to other users (just send me the  
projects to render).  I can't take hordes of render requests, but I'm  
nowhere near that now.  It has sat idle for about 2 months.

>> And yet, if those things are allowed, then they should also be part
>> of the judging.  For example, a scene that uses fog poorly should be
>> docked.  What if someone works hours and hours developing their own
>> light effects, and someone else just uses the POV-Ray lens flare
>> macro?  Are these taken into consideration?  This provides further
>> evidence that the scene contest is too unfocused.  It needs some sort
>> of guidelines to take these variables into account.
>
> I don't think either should be judged on POV-Ray technical merit but
> on quality of the scene. Otherwise you are measuring people's
> patience, research skills and computing access rather than the model
> and layout of the scene. If people are really interested in
> complicated rendering then they can enter a "proper" raytracing
> competition.

Ok, the "hours and hours of writing a lighting effect" is probably a  
bad point.

But how is technical merit and quality different?  If the scene  
contest isn't a raytracing contest, what is it?  Anyway, I discuss  
what I think should be done about this below.

Ok, now I'm just going to list specific contest rules and proceedures  
that I think need changing or adding.

---

This is from the contest rules:

> Entries must use your own model. You must have express permission  
> to use someone else's model(s).

So I can use my own model *and* someone else's if I have their  
permission?  This rule is vague.

I'm just curios why the following rule exists:

> Images may not include any represention of the trademark LEGO®  
> brand insignia.

Is it to avoid trouble with TLG?  All of my renders include the logo  
and I asked Jake McKee about it years ago and he said it wasn't a  
problem as long as I'm not making money off of it.

---

New rules applicable to both contests:

All entries must provide ldraw files (even scenes) and allow them to  
be downloaded by the public.

All entries to both contests need to be unpublished LDraw files or if  
published, be published within the last year (or something).  MOC's  
that were not in LDraw form but were published as pictures may be  
submitted if the LDraw file is new.  (I think this makes it fairer  
for people who don't have a huge arsenal of LDraw models, and it  
gives people who haven't digitized their models a reason to do so-- 
the ultimate goal is to get more LDraw files.)

---

Changes applicable to both contests:

Add 2nd, 3rd places along with honorable mention and include all of  
them on the webpage with the 1st place winners (or something).

Space the contests out, one every other month or one a quarter.   
Using honorable mentions will increase the number of "winners", and  
by decreasing the contest frequency, it will level out more.  Another  
useful side effect is that busy people have more time to work on the  
models.  This also sort of solves the problem of submitting models  
month after month.  This may mean "of the month" may be dropped from  
the titles.  Allow each participant one entry for each month of the  
competition (2 month competition = 2 entries).  Or something.

Voting doesn't start until after the submission deadline.

Set a theme for each contest and give it some specific qualities it  
will be judged by.  Some theme specifics could include buildings,  
civilian space, racers, etc.  This has a lot of potential to generate  
interest.  Possibly    choose the themes by voting or discussion on  
Lugnet.

Ask some of the prolific LDraw users: Mladen, Burkhard  
"Primus" (brickcommander.com) to submit their models.  Even if they  
win month after month, someone will eventually come along with  
something that challenges them.  I think this will increase the  
prestige of winning.

Young authors (if there are any) get their own categories as well.   
Maybe.  Just an idea.

Give out prizes, preferably official Lego sets related to the theme  
of the contest, or just a gift certificate to shop.lego.com.

---

MOC changes:

I think the "Model" contest should be renamed to MOC and make it  
clear that it is a MOC contest.

Set a specific size for the contest, or choose winners for certain  
sizes.  Either way, make it so that someone with a 10000 piece MOC  
isn't competing with a 25 piece MOC.  If there are dozens of small  
entries, possibly give out more honorable mentions or 2nd and 3rd  
prizes.  Give an honorable mention to everyone who submits a 10000  
piece MOC unless it was obviously thrown together.  (I'm using sizes  
very loosely because I have no idea how many pieces a 4 foot model  
would really take)

Build a set of preset POV-Ray scenes users may choose to have their  
model displayed in.  Just a simple backdrop gradient of various  
colors, with the choice of hard or soft lighting.  Use the same  
camera angles already on the rules.  However, along with the entry  
defined camera angles, let them define custom lighting for those  
renders as well (even if it means that the MOC's have lighted elements).

Render all models in POV-Ray with aliasing and radiosity.  Build 360  
degree views of the models.

Voting is split between a panel of judges and the public.  The judges  
will analyze a MOC and will give it points for:
- Instructions built into the LDraw file (does the LDraw file produce  
instructions, and are they effective instructions)
- Posable or animation ability (are movable parts in sub-models, are  
they centered around origins, and is it nested correctly)
- Realistic construction (is it a physically realistic model that can  
be built and shown at BrickFest?)
- How closely it matches the theme and stated goals of the theme

The public would vote on how cool it is.

----

New scene rules:

The Lego models in the scenes must have source LDraw files.  (and  
must be made available to be downloaded by the public)

That way these are disqualified: http://forums.cgsociety.org/ 
showthread.php?t=243823 and http://forums.cgsociety.org/ 
showthread.php?t=111101.  Anton's library is still an option since he  
has an LDraw converter.  Unfortunately, this disqualifies some of the  
best looking scenes I've seen (Anton's, and another user whose name  
eludes me, as well as some of my own...).

Providing scene project is not required (the goal is to get LDraw  
files, not POV-Ray or other ray tracer submissions).

---

Scene changes:

Possibly have a of panel judges vote in addition to the public (like  
the MOC competition).  Judges would award points for:
- Quality of lighting (is it low contrast?)
- Quality of render (is the image grainy?)
- Realistic effects (is the fog a blanket or can you see wisps?, does  
it use depth of field or motion blur effectively)
- Textures (chrome, metal, rubber, index of refraction on transparent  
parts)
- Scene quality (is it balanced, does the eye flow well, is the  
camera placed at a good distance to avoid distortion)
- How close the scene comes to the stated theme
- MOC qualities (the same qualities a MOC is judged by: instructions,  
animation, and realistic)

Some of the things that are easy in Anton's library, but I have no  
idea if this is easy using L3P.  Maybe it could spur some development  
activity...

Public votes on coolness.

Listing things models and scenes are judged by by also gives would-be  
competitors something to strive for.  And I would LOVE for people to  
strive to make their LDraw models animatable!  I can provide  
tutorials better than my current one to help people with this if  
needed.  I still haven't given up hope of getting models from the  
community that I can use.

---

Web page changes:

Use "next" and "prev" links for to switch the archive page contest  
years rather than the popup.  Combine SOTM and MOTM listings into one  
page (maybe, anyway, just get rid of the popups).

Make a link on the front page to current contest entries (and you  
don't have to be logged in to see it).

---

Obviously this is all very ambitious and we are all volunteering our  
time.  So I understand if this is asking for too much.  I know I  
can't pull it all off.  But this is what I would like to see happen  
if changes do happen.

James